General Election 2024: General UK Politics Discussion here

[geared]

58 minutes ago, RollingJ said:

Now I know why it took me 400+ pages to bother looking at this topic - most of it is junior school 'debating'.

 

Junior school debating has some structure to it.

 

This is like watching a few pathetic old men arguing in the pub, regurgitating the opinion given to them by their favourite news outlet.

[RollingJ]

8 minutes ago, geared said:

 

Junior school debating has some structure to it.

 

This is like watching a few pathetic old men arguing in the pub, regurgitating the opinion given to them by their favourite news outlet.

True @geared.

[Al Bundy]

11 hours ago, Mister M said:

We never got to the bottom of Kwarteng's fit of the giggles at the Queen's funeral. 

The book about Truss which you were dismissing earlier Hacks, has plenty of discussion about cocaine. Hmm vair interesting, 

I wonder if Michael Gove was involved?

Does Cocaine make you have fits of giggles?

[hackey lad]

“Irregular migration “ .  Would anyone like to elucidate.

[alchresearch]

And the Labour hypocrisy continues.

 

Last year people all over the country were up in arms when trees were cut down by the evil Tory council in Plymouth for a city centre regeneration project.

 

Many said it was the contributing factor of downfall of the Tory council back in May 23.

 

Fast forward to now, and a Labour MP and a Labour council.......

 

Anger as 'beautiful' trees get the chop at Plymouth Hoe military base

https://www.plymouthherald.co.uk/news/plymouth-news/anger-beautiful-trees-chop-plymouth-9486477

[Mister M]

1 hour ago, alchresearch said:

And the Labour hypocrisy continues.

 

Last year people all over the country were up in arms when trees were cut down by the evil Tory council in Plymouth for a city centre regeneration project.

 

Many said it was the contributing factor of downfall of the Tory council back in May 23.

 

Fast forward to now, and a Labour MP and a Labour council.......

 

Anger as 'beautiful' trees get the chop at Plymouth Hoe military base

https://www.plymouthherald.co.uk/news/plymouth-news/anger-beautiful-trees-chop-plymouth-9486477

Hold the front page.... 

[peak4]

1 hour ago, hackey lad said:

“Irregular migration “ .  Would anyone like to elucidate.

Irregular/Regular, as in Chaotic/Orderly, or maybe in UK terms, Rubber Boats/Immigration Visas
I've no idea where you found the quote in question, but likely refers back to the last conference in Morocco.
Intergovernmental Conference on The Global Compact for Migration  UN

GLOBAL COMPACT FOR SAFE, ORDERLY AND REGULAR MIGRATION FINAL DRAFT UN again

We, the Heads of State and Government and High Representatives, meeting in Morocco on 10 and 11
December 2018, reaffirming the New York Declaration for Refugees and Migrants and determined to
make an important contribution to enhanced cooperation on international migration in all its dimensions,
have adopted this Global Compact for Safe, Orderly and Regular Migration:

The United Nations Global Compact for Migration UK Briefing paper House of Commons Library

Sovereign Borders: International Asylum Comparisons Report UK Home office, possibly leaked

Section 1 might be particularly relevant

[Anna B]

Legal and illegal migration are two separate things. 

I don't think anyone objects to legal migration which is well regulated and monitored. Those  immigrants work hard at jobs that need doing and contribute well to the prosperity and wellbeing of the country.

 

illegal migration is another matter. These are 'criminals'  by the very nature of the way they got here; illegally. 

Therefore there should be no objections to their being accommodated in proper secure camps, (similar to army camps) once they land here. In fact I see no reason why the army can't be in charge. They should be treated with respect but can be kept an eye on while being properly assessed. The genuine refugees can be separated and fast tracked, The economic migrants and chancers should have to work in the camps eg, on plots growing much of  their own food and cooking it, help with cleaning and housekeeping, building and repairing shelter, equipment and facilities, and organise their own recreation and entertainment.

Opportunities to learn the language, laws and British way of life should be offered. Their attitude and willingness to co-operate should earn them points towards the possibility of them being allowed to stay.

 

There should be no automatic right for their relatives to join them if accepted, but again be judged on merit. If accepted as citizens, it should be on licence for a few years to make sure they are an asset to the country, any breaches mean they forfeit their right to stay. It goes without saying that the administration and investigations into their right to stay in the country (or not) should be dealt with far more speedily, and if that means getting more people to do it, so be it. But until then they have no right to expect to wander around the country freely and as is often the case disappear.

 

Underpinning all this should be a satisfactory way of preventing illegal migrants in the first place  while ever fair and legal routes into the country exist.  

 

 

[hackey lad]

58 minutes ago, peak4 said:

Irregular/Regular, as in Chaotic/Orderly, or maybe in UK terms, Rubber Boats/Immigration Visas
I've no idea where you found the quote in question, but likely refers back to the last conference in Morocco.
Intergovernmental Conference on The Global Compact for Migration  UN

GLOBAL COMPACT FOR SAFE, ORDERLY AND REGULAR MIGRATION FINAL DRAFT UN again

We, the Heads of State and Government and High Representatives, meeting in Morocco on 10 and 11
December 2018, reaffirming the New York Declaration for Refugees and Migrants and determined to
make an important contribution to enhanced cooperation on international migration in all its dimensions,
have adopted this Global Compact for Safe, Orderly and Regular Migration:

The United Nations Global Compact for Migration UK Briefing paper House of Commons Library

Sovereign Borders: International Asylum Comparisons Report UK Home office, possibly leaked

Section 1 might be particularly relevant

Sir Keir, today in Germany .

[Delayed]

37 minutes ago, Anna B said:

Legal and illegal migration are two separate things. 

I don't think anyone objects to legal migration which is well regulated and monitored. Those  immigrants work hard at jobs that need doing and contribute well to the prosperity and wellbeing of the country.

 

Legal migration routes into the UK are not just about working hard. There are legal routes into the UK where work is not the sole reason. 

 

37 minutes ago, Anna B said:

 

illegal migration is another matter. These are 'criminals'  by the very nature of the way they got here; illegally. 

Therefore there should be no objections to their being accommodated in proper secure camps, (similar to army camps) once they land here.

 

Due to the sheer number of people considered to be 'illegal', this camp of yours would be massive. And of course that would need maintenance, security, etc which would cost the tax laher significant sums. Where we have problems housing our own prisoners....

 

37 minutes ago, Anna B said:

 

 

In fact I see no reason why the army can't be in charge.

 

 

Other than the fact that it's not their function? 

 

37 minutes ago, Anna B said:

They should be treated with respect but can be kept an eye on while being properly assessed. The genuine refugees can be separated and fast tracked,

 

Fast tracking does not mean approving their visa.  The most time consuming element of the Asylum considerations is determining whether there is a genuine claim in the first place. 

 

And don't confuse genuineness with a person's character. 

 

37 minutes ago, Anna B said:

The economic migrants and chancers should have to work in the camps eg, on plots growing much of  their own food and cooking it, help with cleaning and housekeeping, building and repairing shelter, equipment and facilities, and organise their own recreation and entertainment.

 

Name me another country that treats asylum seekers in the same way?

 

37 minutes ago, Anna B said:

Opportunities to learn the language, laws and British way of life should be offered. Their attitude and willingness to co-operate should earn them points towards the possibility of them being allowed to stay.

 

You mean like a Life in the UK Test and also English tests that earns points on existing visa routes?

 

https://www.gov.uk/life-in-the-uk-test

 

37 minutes ago, Anna B said:

 

There should be no automatic right for their relatives to join them if accepted, but again be judged on merit.

 

 

There isn't now. 

 

37 minutes ago, Anna B said:

If accepted as citizens, it should be on licence for a few years to make sure they are an asset to the country, any breaches mean they forfeit their right to stay.

 

You mean like there is now, where criminality is considered as Suitability criteria? 

 

37 minutes ago, Anna B said:

 

It goes without saying that the administration and investigations into their right to stay in the country (or not) should be dealt with far more speedily, and if that means getting more people to do it, so be it. But until then they have no right to expect to wander around the country freely and as is often the case disappear.

 

They don't. Most are granted immigration bail. 

 

37 minutes ago, Anna B said:

 

Underpinning all this should be a satisfactory way of preventing illegal migrants in the first place  while ever fair and legal routes into the country exist.