Israel / Gaza / Lebanon / Iran War Thread

[Alextopman]

1 hour ago, RJRB said:

@cuttsie

So you re -define genocide to suit your views.

 

Add to that your assumption that the terrorists had the full backing of all Palestinians.

Plus your failure to understand that the Israeli encroachment on Palestinian territory has gone on for years.

Plus the treatment and displacement of Palestinians from their homelands and subjugation of those who continued to live in Jerusalem.

I believe even more that Netanyahu was either negligent in his defence of Israel’s borders or complicit in allowing a situation that would allow his current destruction of  Gaza and its people

The use of concrete was supposed to be monitored but thousands and thousands of tons was used to build miles of underground tunnels, the excavated earth needed to be disposed of, hundreds of workers must have been involved.

Are you suggesting all this went on without the knowledge of the Palestinians?.

[Delbow]

For a long time, there has been a view that the reason Israel receives so much military aid, primarily from the US, has nothing to do with western governments believing in the right of the Jewish people to self-determination and everything to do with keeping a check on Arab nationalism which threatens the flow of cheap oil from corrupt autocracies in the region.

 

The response of western governments to Netenyahu's extremist stance of 'we'll never allow any Palestinian state, we'll never stop killing Arabs, we'll never stop absorbing more and more Palestinian land into Israel' gives credence to this view. Clearly, patience with Israel's stance is running thin because far from keeping stability in the region, it risks a regional war and potentially a world war - while some in the military-industrial complex would welcome that, the consequences for oil prices and global trade and therefore ultimately profits is clear. So now we have David Cameron trying to whip the Israeli government into line by threatening to go ahead and recognise a Palestinian state. Another option on the table is to scale back military aid to Israel so that the state is only capable of genuine defence rather than ethnic genocide and land grabbing dressed as defence.

 

In the middle east, we have seen how quickly the US will drop its allies once they've served America's purposes: the Mujahedeen in Afghanistan, the Kurds in the fight against ISIS. Support for Israel from fickle western governments is not guaranteed, especially as the global economy weans itself off oil.

[RJRB]

57 minutes ago, Alextopman said:

The use of concrete was supposed to be monitored but thousands and thousands of tons was used to build miles of underground tunnels, the excavated earth needed to be disposed of, hundreds of workers must have been involved.

Are you suggesting all this went on without the knowledge of the Palestinians?.

I have no idea what point you are making.

These tunnels were not constructed overnight and some of the underground works were apparently the work of Israeli design and construction.

I don’t find underground defences and refuges at all surprising for a country under threat every bit as much as Israeli territory.

Are you saying that 2 million Palestinians were involved in the construction or had access to the tunnels.

What exactly has been found in these tunnels so far.

Your reference seems a bit off the wall to me.

[cuttsie]

8 minutes ago, Delbow said:

For a long time, there has been a view that the reason Israel receives so much military aid, primarily from the US, has nothing to do with western governments believing in the right of the Jewish people to self-determination and everything to do with keeping a check on Arab nationalism which threatens the flow of cheap oil from corrupt autocracies in the region.

 

The response of western governments to Netenyahu's extremist stance of 'we'll never allow any Palestinian state, we'll never stop killing Arabs, we'll never stop absorbing more and more Palestinian land into Israel' gives credence to this view. Clearly, patience with Israel's stance is running thin because far from keeping stability in the region, it risks a regional war and potentially a world war - while some in the military-industrial complex would welcome that, the consequences for oil prices and global trade and therefore ultimately profits is clear. So now we have David Cameron trying to whip the Israeli government into line by threatening to go ahead and recognise a Palestinian state. Another option on the table is to scale back military aid to Israel so that the state is only capable of genuine defence rather than ethnic genocide and land grabbing dressed as defence.

 

In the middle east, we have seen how quickly the US will drop its allies once they've served America's purposes: the Mujahedeen in Afghanistan, the Kurds in the fight against ISIS. Support for Israel from fickle western governments is not guaranteed, especially as the global economy weans itself off oil.

Yes The Kurds have been betrayed by us and the US .

[Alextopman]

3 minutes ago, RJRB said:

I have no idea what point you are making.

These tunnels were not constructed overnight and some of the underground works were apparently the work of Israeli design and construction.

I don’t find underground defences and refuges at all surprising for a country under threat every bit as much as Israeli territory.

Are you saying that 2 million Palestinians were involved in the construction or had access to the tunnels.

What exactly has been found in these tunnels so far.

Your reference seems a bit off the wall to me.

Battles have been fought in those  tunnnels , they have been used to enter another country to slaughter and Kidnap people.

All construction was supposed to be approved and these tunnels were not, so how did they approve all the concrete and materials?.

Tunnel entrances under hospitals etc,

Attacking people at a concert and slaughtering them .

These so called underground defences were not legally constructed and clearly used for the opposite of defence

[RJRB]

3 minutes ago, Alextopman said:

Battles have been fought in those  tunnnels , they have been used to enter another country to slaughter and Kidnap people.

All construction was supposed to be approved and these tunnels were not, so how did they approve all the concrete and materials?.

Tunnel entrances under hospitals etc,

Attacking people at a concert and slaughtering them .

These so called underground defences were not legally constructed and clearly used for the opposite of defence

Construction approved by who?

As a country in its own right I would assume that they could construct their own defences just as Israel and Egypt do,

The early tunnels were constructed to smuggle in goods when Gaza were subject to embargoes .

The instances of tunnels extending into Israel and Egypt are few and far between.

The taking of “hostages “is relatively easy under Israel’s “legal” system.

Unfortunately that leads to the taking of Israeli hostages as future bargaining chips.

[Delbow]

21 minutes ago, cuttsie said:

Yes The Kurds have been betrayed by us and the US .

You really have to conceptualise the US state as a psychopathic serial rapist and murderer to have a hope of predicting what they'll do next.

[Alextopman]

10 minutes ago, RJRB said:

Construction approved by who?

As a country in its own right I would assume that they could construct their own defences just as Israel and Egypt do,

The early tunnels were constructed to smuggle in goods when Gaza were subject to embargoes .

The instances of tunnels extending into Israel and Egypt are few and far between.

The taking of “hostages “is relatively easy under Israel’s “legal” system.

Unfortunately that leads to the taking of Israeli hostages as future bargaining chips.

“At times,” he wrote in the Post, “I argued with Israeli leaders and security officials, telling them they needed to allow more construction materials, including cement, into Gaza so that housing, schools and basic infrastructure could be built. They countered that Hamas would misuse it, and they were right.”

[cuttsie]

9 minutes ago, Delbow said:

You really have to conceptualise the US state as a psychopathic serial rapist and murderer to have a hope of predicting what they'll do next.

Like Russia , Like Iran , and a cast of many .

[RJRB]

2 minutes ago, Alextopman said:

“At times,” he wrote in the Post, “I argued with Israeli leaders and security officials, telling them they needed to allow more construction materials, including cement, into Gaza so that housing, schools and basic infrastructure could be built. They countered that Hamas would misuse it, and they were right.”

Well they will certainly need construction materials in the future looking at the devastation that continues.

Who wrote in The Post Incidentally.