Wheres all the RnB gone??

[BRINGITON]

I knew you would come in and strike. When people think of USA hip hop gangsters they do not think of chavs from the manor do they. Ooops thats deemed as racist to but you do not know my TRUE ethnicity either but Im sure you get the picture.

You need to read carefully I said it COULD be deemed to be racist. I like you because you love to take out words what I write what you want to read instead of taking out the full literature.

 

He was talking about the clientelle, not the artists. Hence saying 'Most RnB nights will be full of.."

 

And you're right, I don't know your ethnicity but then I'm not suggesting your comments COULD be racist. And I do read carefully, hence also using the word COULD in both my posts.

 

By the way, you'll be suprised to hear I fully agree that Bobby was stereotyping, just curious as to how that translates into POTENTIAL racism. I could see your point if he was talking about artists but fans can be of any creed (as you well know). ********s come in all colours and don't have to like RnB to qualify.

 

 

If it's just a case of you misunderstanding and thinking he was on about artists then that's cool.

[sexyny]

Why hate the empire bar???

[discodown]

discodown, I can tell your disgusted with the common word R&B. if you new your music history well the terminology R&B / soul is basically the same thing. soul (late 50's 60's, 70's to mid 80's). It is a combination with gospel vocals thats all as most of the singers had church backgrounds.

Thelma Houston, Dionne Warwick, Al Green IS old skool r&b, which IS if you wanna get scientific old skool disco as that is where house came from. Sam Cooke R&B (rhythm n blues).

Just because you do not like 21st century R&B because they use more electronics and hip hop does not mean it lacks soul. Jill Scott, Erykah Badu are prime examples.

I suggest get an American cable and watch old soul train re-runs

And I suggest you stop patronising people because they don't agree with you.

 

Your arrogance is breathtaking and your contradictory statements require a little thought.

 

Lets run through a few of your points one by one.

 

discodown, I can tell your disgusted with the common word R&B.

How can you possibly tell that? You know virtually nothing about me. For all you know I may love modern r n b.

if you new your music history well the terminology R&B / soul is basically the same thing.

How do you know I don't? Who died and appointed you the voice of musical reason for the forum? If the terminology for soul and r n b is virtually the same then i'm not wrong am I? as it goes i'm merely expressing an opinion not stating a cast iron fact.

soul (late 50's 60's, 70's to mid 80's). It is a combination with gospel vocals thats all as most of the singers had church backgrounds.

Actually soul is an offshoot of blues combined with the acceptable face of black music in 1950's america, the so-called '***** spirituals' which were deemed more acceptable than jazz which was sometimes violently opposed by the authorities. The uplifting vocals of the spirituals were popularised by artists such as sam cooke and a little later solomon burke, marvin gaye and so on. The gospel part of it is from the nature of the these early songs to be sung by groups of slaves.

Thelma Houston, Dionne Warwick, Al Green IS old skool r&b

So according to you we can ignore sam cooke, smokey robinson, wilson pickett, fats domino, marvin gaye, martha reeves and the vandellas, stevie wonder, solomon burke, the drifters, the four tops, motown, aretha franklin and loads more artists?

which IS if you wanna get scientific old skool disco as that is where house came from.

r n b is not disco in the same way that hip hop is not r n b. There are small but important differences. disco is faster and emphasises the beat and the rhythm more than the meaning of the song. Thats not to say that much of discos message wasn't positive or it lacked something lyrically, its more that with the advent of new technology disco could be more experimental which allowed it to express itself much more. Indeed much of disco is incredibly soulful and indeed it stems from an offshoot of philly soul which artists such as teddy pendergrass popularised with many of the first disco records made by soul artists such as eddie kendricks and barry white.

 

The only reason r n b and disco are often lumped together is because at that time the music industry was basically run by white middle class men who had no idea about black music. Do you really wish to discuss disco in more detail?!

Just because you do not like 21st century R&B because they use more electronics and hip hop does not mean it lacks soul.

Again how do you know i don't like 21st century r n b? I am tempted to suggest you are paranoid but I shan't.

 

I've also never said it lacks soul, just the opposite. I've suggested that it is soul as opposed to r n b

I suggest get an American cable and watch old soul train re-runs

just the cable?! not a tv channel just a cable?!

 

The issue I have with soul train is that all the people who appeared on it were necessarily soul artists so its not a definative guide to soul. I wouldn't like to say that george clinton, issac hayes, chic, sly and the family stone, funkadelic, curtis mayfield were all necessarily soul. as an overview of everything thats good about 1960's and 70's black american music there is no better program.

 

Finally i'm going to apologise for the aggressive nature of this post. Just because someone doesn't agree with you is no reason to launch a verbal barrage at them. I have responded to your post in the aggressive way you responded to mine. If you wish me to less aggressive in future you know what to do.

[discodown]

i think youll find that bar UNIQ has no attitude or wannabe gangstas in the premises as they simlpy dont get in!!!, its a lovely atmosphere and the customers are a great bunch of people that are there purley there to have a good night! I think youll find like you said millions of people love RnB hip hop garage etc! so the entertainment buisness cater for them aswell as other sorts of music for what other people want. UNIQ bar/club is very diverse as they have different kinds of music through the month for different tastes that people like and want from RIDDIMTION, HEADCHARGE and URBAN GORILLA.

who is running uniq? they are doing a cracking job and really turning that venue around. hats off to them

[paradise]

who is running uniq? they are doing a cracking job and really turning that venue around. hats off to them

 

thank you very much for the compliment your comments are much appreciated its took along time and alot of hard work from all the staff to get across to people that the venue is not what it used to be and is now a nice friendly club/bar with a nice vibe. We are very much trying to please everyone and so have different music on different nights for everyones tastes in music! lets hope it all works out?

[muddycoffee]

I was in west street live last night and there was an R and B band playing. I think they were called "the call" and were a seven piece.

 

I have just checked myspace and I don't think that band were the call.

[discodown]

thank you very much for the compliment your comments are much appreciated its took along time and alot of hard work from all the staff to get across to people that the venue is not what it used to be and is now a nice friendly club/bar with a nice vibe. We are very much trying to please everyone and so have different music on different nights for everyones tastes in music! lets hope it all works out?

you're doing well, i've not been to that venue for about 3 years but i'm going to go soon to see whats happeneing

[peacenlove]

Why hate the empire bar???

 

yeah i don't get that either, there's nothing wrong with the place

[uniq]

Check out the RnB & UK Garage Night every Tuesday @ Uniq Nightclub. This is a weekly student night with fantastic drinks offers and excellent music.

[dj4321]

And I suggest you stop patronising people because they don't agree with you.

 

 

 

 

Finally i'm going to apologise for the aggressive nature of this post. Just because someone doesn't agree with you is no reason to launch a verbal barrage at them. I have responded to your post in the aggressive way you responded to mine. If you wish me to less aggressive in future you know what to do.

 

Problem with you discodown you have taken this very personal because if i have stated something to debate about you will find in the archives its true. Does the truth really hurt that you have to attack me. It took you a few posts to load your ammunition.

 

Point 1)

Your arrogance is breathtaking and your contradictory statements require a little thought.

 

Not once have i said anything of being the voice of reason. I replied to a post about R&B and the stereotypes and attitude it brings. As I have been playing for nearly 20 years I have played in clubs around the country and seen a lot of excellent R&B nights. I have also seen the downside also but to target a scene as pure attitude and gangsters poisonous pen writing in my view.

 

Point 2)

 

The point you made is exactly the same as I stated. SOUL is just a word because the singers represented were from church gospel spiritual choirs etc.

I am glad you have educated yourselves on the old skool artists. I bet you dont have any records by them?

The way you go about this forum you sound like you are anti R&B but that is my opinion I just feel you do not say anything constructive but slate it.

 

 

Point 3)

 

Did you want me to state all the bloody singers, I did mention Sam Cooke and Aretha franklyn, but yet again you never read you just take out the bits you want to use against me like a redneck newspaper from 60's Alabama. Why would I want to ignore these other singers as they are massive. I could mention more but this post is about WHERE HAS ALL THE R&B GONE IN SHEFFIELD. Something that you could not give 2 ****s about.

 

Point 4)

 

Disco and RNB

I refer you to listen to a record by Blaze (do you remember house) In the states, people do not categorize music as intensely like in the UK. Serious Intention - You dont know, was one of the first house tracks to come out of NY / NJ. However this was classed as a club track as the house terminology word was not known in New York. In the 80's djs would play R&B tracks back to back with early house tracks as it was appreciated with any soul crowd.

I tell you what, as I am a arrogant man, when Farley is in the country next, which I predict in Xmas. I will bring him down to your open decks night and he will tell you some knowledge as you feel nobody else can give you knowledge as you know it all.

 

Point 5)

 

What are you going on about aggression. It seems to me if any one is aggressive it is you. You are the one that has launched the assault. I am not aggressive person however you do strike me as a person proper up your own arse and you try to find arguements in fields you have no true understandings of. I bet you was not even into soul music in the 70's. So how can you have any realistic or social understanding.

I have had my say now hopefully we can talk about why there is no upfront R&B nights in Sheffield, something that you could not give a toss about.

 

Point 6)

 

Which i feel is a very important point is this. you can educate yourself on all the books in the world. Unless you have lived through the decades and seen how music has evolved around your area, from soul / r&b - disco - house - hip hop, then you can say you understand it. In the 70's & 80's black people were still getting turned away from sheffield clubs that played this music based on the colour of skin and nothing else. I even know of cases in the 90's in 2000 but I wont name and shame but I am sure people reading this will know what i am talking about. Which makes me go back to the point about stereotypes that bobby posted. That is why I responded to him like that. Even to this day there is a lot of frustration within the black and ethnic minorities in the UK. This is more of a social issue, however how many times I have heard the same old cliches in clubbing. You would have thought we have come a long way since the 70's but I think we as a clubbing nation has gone backwards as I feel it is very segregated in certain areas. Only difference is loads of money pumped into it thats all. Have a think about it as I do not think it as ever crossed your mind. Promoters / djs doing R&B nights in inner cities have the hardest job in the world. That is pleasing the manager.