Who's the best BJJ team in Sheffield/area?

[troyhark]

With regards to knife defence. We did a bit last night at Jujitsu. Old T-Shirts and Marker Pens.

 

Everyone was marked all over (i.e very dead indeed).

 

The bottom line is that you'll probably die if faced with a knife, so just run, or give them your wallet... or bend over (whatever they want) haha

Maybe you should learn better techniques!!

But even with better techniques getting a few marks would be expected. Besides if you get a few slices befor you managed to snap your assailants arm in half, surely that is better than being gutted.

A few years ago I saw [on Calendar or similar] SY Police training against knives. The techniques would get them killed, they were awful. And this is the police being taught.

 

As for gun defences, there are none, unless the gun wielder is stupid enough to get quite close to you. Again these defences simply give you a better chance than not knowing them. Just like MA gives you a better chance in a fight than no MA. Nothing is guaranteed in a fight situation.

[Lee Mapley]

Maybe you should learn better techniques!!

 

Or just run. Honestly

[troyhark]

Or just run. Honestly

You seem to be mising the point somewhat.

You use these techniques only if you cannot leg it and a knife heads towards you. It's been said several times in the thread. Exactly the same as you only use defence against an unarmed attacker if you cannot leg it.

[troyhark]

What is your plan when you are faced with a gun gentlemen (and ladies)?

 

How do you train for such a situation? This brings me back to my original point. How can you inject some realism into this type of scenario and still keep it safe enough to practise? Is this a foolhardy pursuit (can you seriously, hand on heart recommend to someone that they should take on a gunman and that the techniques you have shown them are failsafe)?

No self defence is failsafe. None at all. Against unarmed attackers or those armed with weapons. It simply gives you a better chance than no training. Only a naive person would claim otherwise.

Not sure why this is so difficult to understand.

 

Actually being attacked with a weapon is easier to defend in one respect as the weapon tends to signify/limit the type of attack. If someone is standing in front of you brandishing a cosh with his right hand he's less likely to punch with his left or kick you, than if he had no weapon. As weaponless, he can kick or punch with either foot/hand or even try grappling.

 

As for training with guns, you use replicas and if trigger is pulled before you deal with problem, the technique can be considered to have failed. You don't need live ammo to train this sort of defence as it's kind of obvious it hasn't worked.

[want2learn]

train gun defenses using water pistols

[fingercuffs]

No need to patronise.

 

I have been told that i should have same strategy regardless of what i am faced with. Which is to have trained for all eventualities.

My current choice is to avoid it wherever possible.

From what i can see from the comments there are some reasons why i couldnt evade a knife confrontation. If presented with a situation where there is a knife, why should it be any different to if it is a gun, or a baseball bat, sword etc. A weapon is a weapon, and the odds are stacked against you.

 

I think it is a contradiction to say that you can run away if someone pulls a gun on you, but to make sure you are trained adequately to cope with knives.

 

I cannot get my head around the fact that if you cannot run (which is a legitimate point), that you take on a person with a weapon. Why not use some mediation or bargaining skills? This works for terrorist negotiators who face much larger risks and more dangerous outcomes.

Yes there are limited attacks when it comes to weapons. Perhaps you feel you can train against knives, a gunman will most likely shoot you before you get close (isnt that the point of a gun?). Many people who are going to brandish a gun are likely to be nervous, twitchy and have a somewhat itchy trigger finger. You are just as likely to get shot for sneezing, let alone trying to take on the dude.

Just for the record, i have been faced with a gun on more than one confrontation in N. Ireland. I was nowhere near close enough to do anything about this. I had to use communication.

I would do the same with a knife, baseball bat, sword.

 

Everyone is entitled to their own outlook on life and this is mine, you have yours.

 

For all those who are getting frustrated with the references to BJJ on this thread, may i just remind you of the thread title.

To be honest, if there was a separate thread about weapon defences i would even have bothered reading it beacause i think that you are asking for trouble if you take on an armed person.

For those of you that do, good luck. You'll need it. But stop trying to ram your opinions down everyone's throat. you are no better than jehovahs.

[troyhark]

train gun defenses using water pistols

Excellent suggestion! Use red dye too!

[troyhark]

I cannot get my head around the fact that if you cannot run (which is a legitimate point), that you take on a person with a weapon. Why not use some mediation or bargaining skills?

Nobody's said you cannot do that.

Just for the record, i have been faced with a gun on more than one confrontation in N. Ireland. I was nowhere near close enough to do anything about this. I had to use communication.

I would do the same with a knife, baseball bat, sword.

Which is sensible, but that again is missing the point. Defences against knife attacks are to be used when you have no option. i.e. you are actually being attacked, you cannot run, talking isn't going to work.

MA has been mentioned as a last resort, not a first option.

 

Everyone is entitled to their own outlook on life and this is mine, you have yours.

 

For all those who are getting frustrated with the references to BJJ on this thread, may i just remind you of the thread title.

To be honest, if there was a separate thread about weapon defences i would even have bothered reading it beacause i think that you are asking for trouble if you take on an armed person.

For those of you that do, good luck. You'll need it. But stop trying to ram your opinions down everyone's throat. you are no better than jehovahs.

Nobodies doing any ramming, explaining maybe. And I don't recall anybody suggesting anyone should take on an armed attacker. The general line has been if you train against a variety of attacks you will be better equipped than someone who hasn't if it comes to the crunch. Karate people will tend to come unstuck if grappling is involved for instance.

[fingercuffs]

Which is sensible, but that again is missing the point. Defences against knife attacks are to be used when you have no option. i.e. you are actually being attacked, you cannot run, talking isn't going to work.

MA has been mentioned as a last resort, not a first option.

 

Kinves are not the only weapon. So shouldn't this apply to all weapons. As i said, what if you are faced with a gun? Should you try and defend yourself here also? I do not think you will be able to get close enough to defend yourself against a gun. Therefore you will have to negotiate.

 

So why is it possible to negotiate against a gunman but not a knife attacker?

 

I think that there is a contradiction here.

 

If you are saying that you should take on a gunman, i would question your sanity.

 

So which is it?

 

1) gunmen are nicer than knife attackers and therefore you can talk them round?

 

2) All weapon brandishing madmen are the same and we should be ready to take on knife wielding maniacs as well as a double barrel toting psycho?

[troyhark]

If presented with a situation where there is a knife, why should it be any different to if it is a gun, or a baseball bat, sword etc. A weapon is a weapon, and the odds are stacked against you.

Have you trained against a variety of weapons? I would guess not as they vary in degrees of difficulty enormously. And a baseball bat is a cumbersome and clunky weapon actually and can be easier to deal with than an unarmed person.

 

I think it is a contradiction to say that you can run away if someone pulls a gun on you, but to make sure you are trained adequately to cope with knives.

Nobody's said that AFAIK. Besides running away is not exactly a gun defence. It simply means you get shot in the back instead!