Martin Dust Posted March 17, 2007 Share Posted March 17, 2007 Blyton's depiction of the gollywog characters are the problem from a modern perspective, not the gollywogs themselves. The language and the attitudes expressed are very much of their time. I believe modern versions of those works of Blyton's which cause problems have been changed. . I think you are wrong here, Blyton is well know for her racist views and put into that context, it makes the whole thing a bit worrying to say the least. And the dolls design is based on a gross caricature of black people so how can you separate the two, they are not exclusive. A small child sees a cuddly doll. S/he isn't aware of the connotations, negative or otherwise. The problem is with some adults who might choose to use the dolls as an excuse to pass the associated stereotypical nonsense on to the child. A gollywog in the hands of a small child with sensible, rational parents isn't an issue. It's just a doll. Numpty parents will find a way to pass on racist garbage to their kids anyway. True but knowing the history is it acceptable? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melthebell Posted March 17, 2007 Share Posted March 17, 2007 I think you are wrong here, Blyton is well know for her racist views and put into that context, it makes the whole thing a bit worrying to say the least. And the dolls design is based on a gross caricature of black people so how can you separate the two, they are not exclusive. True but knowing the history is it acceptable? but its a different age, like should we be proud to be british even tho we know what the british empire did to other peoples taking their lands by force. i believe even blytons books no longer feature the racism to that extent, should they be banned? like we said....some people know and dwell on the history, some use them to reminicse about their childhood, and kids just have them as dolls....no idea, no history, no racism, no threat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Dust Posted March 17, 2007 Share Posted March 17, 2007 theres a difference in how you use em like certain "offensive" words, they can be used affectionately......or used for abuse. a 3 year old would play with a golliwog toy just the same as any other doll its adults that insert racist thought/behaviours Golliwogg, Gollywog and Wog are well know racial slurs that started after the first World War, the context changed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Dust Posted March 17, 2007 Share Posted March 17, 2007 but its a different age, like should we be proud to be british even tho we know what the british empire did to other peoples taking their lands by force. i believe even blytons books no longer feature the racism to that extent, should they be banned? like we said....some people know and dwell on the history, some use them to reminicse about their childhood, and kids just have them as dolls....no idea, no history, no racism, no threat It is a different age but I don't think that's an excuses we can use, wrong is wrong isn't it? You can take things on a surface level if you wish but the facts remain the same - they are built around a gross caricature. You can find the facts if you wish to look... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pattricia Posted March 17, 2007 Share Posted March 17, 2007 What the heck are we going to do about " Snow WHITE and Seven Dwarfs" ? The mind boggles, where will it end ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Dust Posted March 17, 2007 Share Posted March 17, 2007 What the heck are we going to do about " Snow WHITE and Seven Dwarfs" ? The mind boggles, where will it end ? That's completely different, you probably know that tho Pattricia. I know some of you will feel that this is PC madness but all I ask is that you look into the history and just question things. I do think that some things are indeed PC madness but I think this is very different and is well documented enough for people to make an informed choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melthebell Posted March 17, 2007 Share Posted March 17, 2007 It is a different age but I don't think that's an excuses we can use, wrong is wrong isn't it? You can take things on a surface level if you wish but the facts remain the same - they are built around a gross caricature. You can find the facts if you wish to look... almost all nursery rhymes have dodgy origins should they be banned? words like ****** and other *offensive* words get taken back and used in a different light, shouldnt black people use the word as it was once a term of abuse? surely in a similer way, using golliwogs as they should be used...ie:- kids playing with them in a none racially abusive way is akin to taking em back and showing them in a more positive light? like i said before its about context, if you use them as a stereotype or as abuse then they will be Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Dust Posted March 17, 2007 Share Posted March 17, 2007 almost all nursery rhymes have dodgy origins should they be banned? words like ****** and other *offensive* words get taken back and used in a different light, shouldnt black people use the word as it was once a term of abuse? First, we are talking about one thing and I've tried to present a balanced case of why it isn't acceptable, the call after that is yours. What nursey rhymes are you talking about? surely in a similer way, using golliwogs as they should be used...ie:- kids playing with them in a none racially abusive way is akin to taking em back and showing them in a more positive light? like i said before its about context, if you use them as a stereotype or as abuse then they will be How can it be seen in a postive light when you know their history? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
liquid_pig Posted March 17, 2007 Share Posted March 17, 2007 For the (majority) of people they don't see golly **** as offensive.It shouldn't be.When I was at secondary school i was teased and called names,one of them being "golly wog" or simply "wog".It doesn't offend me but if someone called me one today in an offensive way i would rip their effin' head off!!!,however,One aspect of the debate in its favour argues that it should be preserved and passed on as a cherished cultural artifact and childhood tradition, while opposers argue it should be retired as a relic of an earlier time when anti-black racism was as casual as it was blatant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melthebell Posted March 17, 2007 Share Posted March 17, 2007 First, we are talking about one thing and I've tried to present a balanced case of why it isn't acceptable, the call after that is yours. What nursey rhymes are you talking about? How can it be seen in a postive light when you know their history? i dont think you get what i mean............i mean positive NOW never mind then (the history) your treating it as a kids toy, not a racist tool most nursery rhymes arent very nice when you look deeper. i think mary mary quite contrary was posted on here before, and is about killing and stuff obviously ring a ring o posies is about the plague all not very nice if you look at the history Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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