Cyclone Posted March 29, 2007 Share Posted March 29, 2007 What are you talking about? Why is it that when anyone makes a comment about men maybe showing them in the not so perfect light they may prefer to bask in, it's a big deal to some and yet threads are started everyday criticising women and we're supposed to take it in good part? Is this now the part of the thread where I'm supposed to say that my comment was only meant in jest or tongue in cheek and that you have no sense of humour? This is the part where you are meant to apologise but clearly aren't going to. I don't know how you think you can defend saying that most men have committed rape though. I think it might be best if you just dropped it. I have no idea which threads you think you are just supposed 'to take', I doubt you'd keep quiet though if someone posted that all women were child abusers, I think that's a fairly good parallel. I don't think debate on a forum consists of people 'shouting one another down' and 'telling them to stop it', does it? If the scenario I outlined has never applied to you why are you so concerned? I'm merely posting a speculation about so called 'date rape'. If I'm wrong, let my own sex 'shout me down' about it. You should be taking what I say on board and examining your collective consciences, IMO, not shouting me down and telling me to stop it, which is what you seem to be trying to do. I don't have a collective conscience, so I can only examine my own. I am offended by your comments about men in general though and I'm quite happy to tell you that you're wrong, you're sexist and I dislike discussing topics with people who have to resort to base accusations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darbees Posted March 29, 2007 Share Posted March 29, 2007 Ruby, I have never committed rape and following on from the hysterical oubursts on Sunday when I made a comment which was wrongly taken to be a slur and generalisation of females I can't help but think some of your remarks represent crass hypocracy. You said it was all banter with the big girls on Sunday, is this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
funkymiss Posted March 29, 2007 Share Posted March 29, 2007 am I bovvered? You're right though, I'm sure a lot of us would rather be unpartnered forever, than stuck with someone with some of the outdated attitudes you find in some men. But why are you taking it so personally? Have I hit a nerve or something? Surely you aren't guilty of having skewed attitudes towards women? You do generalise a lot about men though and make some pretty bad accusations towards some blokes. Not everything is women vs men. I don't think the men on this thread are doing anymore 'browbeating' than the women. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rubydazzler Posted March 29, 2007 Share Posted March 29, 2007 You do generalise a lot about men though and make some pretty bad accusations towards some blokes. Not everything is women vs men. I don't think the men on this thread are doing anymore 'browbeating' than the women. I know, generalising is probably a bad thing, and it is done a lot on the Forum, but I haven't made any accusations towards "some blokes", ie not anyone personally. I'm just putting forward a point of view which may or may not be shared by others. Maybe I'm just over sensitive, and talking about my being libellous and implying that I ought to be reported to the mods for my opinion isn't actually trying to browbeat me into backing down? For myself, I can take it in good part when it's about something fairly innocuous like driving but I think something like this generates a lot of hidden feelings in people. I don't, anymore, take things said on here so personally as some people seem to do, it's debate and not addressed to anyone in particular. I've spent a lot of time listening to people with relationship issues and having been involved in Women's Studies courses, possibly that colours my interpretation of things I read on the Forum. As they say, the interpretation of the person who feels they're the injured party should hold sway. I feel women are the injured party and some of the men feel they are, so what more can you say? I'm not really sure who the men on this thread are anyway, it's often difficult to know which is which, given the gender neutral names some members have chosen. However, I've given my opinion and don't want to be accused of taking the thread any more off topic that we already have, so I'll withdraw now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darbees Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 As they say, the interpretation of the person who feels they're the injured party should hold sway. I feel women are the injured party and some of the men feel they are, so what more can you say? Presumably you are referring back to original point of the thread here. This is the whole point of this debate. Yes we all know, even the men, that someone has been raped is the injured party, however in this case the supposedly injured party has not been able to prove as such and so the man has to be given the benefit of the doubt as there definitely is in this case. If the man has raped her and got away with I hope it stays on his conscience forever and he doesn't ever do anything like that again but, conversely if he hasn't, the same thing applies to the woman. It doesn't look like we will ever know. The justice system cannot work if there are certain crimes where the "victim" holds sway and the defendant is guilty until proved innocent and in these days of equality that would certainly be a massive retrograde step if that only applied to crimes against women. If your views were taken as the general female viewpoint it would set feminism back 20 or 30 years, fortunately I know for certain that your views do not represent the general female view. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Banjo Griner Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 What's wrong with being 'laddish'? Being a 'lad' (or, being 'in touch with your masculinity') doesn't mean you are a beer-swilling, wife-beating rapist. I keep thinking of the Viz character 'Millie Tant'. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darbees Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 What's wrong with being 'laddish'? Being a 'lad' (or, being 'in touch with your masculinity') doesn't mean you are a beer-swilling, wife-beating rapist. I keep thinking of the Viz character 'Millie Tant'. lol Unfortunately I can't refer you to thread when I got a savaging for suggesting that the other day cos it has been deleted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poppy1 Posted March 31, 2007 Share Posted March 31, 2007 I think a lot of men want to 'blame the victim' because if they were to be totally honest with themselves, a lot of them will have been in the position of having coerced or forced a girl into having sex with them at some time in their lives. Cases like this make them feel guilty either on their own behalf or on behalf of other men.. Sad to say that I’ve read a lot of extremely harsh, sexist comments on sf and the vast majority were posted by women but this one takes the biscuit Ruby and I can only hope that it’s just your idea of a joke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hennypenny Posted March 31, 2007 Share Posted March 31, 2007 This is very much a misconception. A very small % of rape accusations even make it to trial, and by small we're talking <10%. Conviction rates are obviously lower than this as only a portion of those making it to trial are convicted. On the other hand there have been cases where women making provably false accusations have been successfully prosecuted... A friend of mine was raped a few weeks ago, by a friend of her son's in her own home. She was quite badly hurt and needed hospital treatment. She has just emailed me to say she has decided to drop the case because she feels she is being treated as though she is the criminal, not the victim, by the police. I am hoping to persuade her to carry on, but without going into detail she has been very badly treated by the police. I encouraged her to contact a rape crisis centre, but there doesn't seem to be one that is still open, having contacted a few to be told they have closed - this is in London! I am having to keep in close contact with her as she sounds suicidal in emails - before the attack she was a perfectly normal stable respectable housewife Her sons have been unable to cope with the fact it was their friend that did this, and have also become deeply depressed. Violent attacks ruin lives in more ways than just the obvious injury. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Banjo Griner Posted March 31, 2007 Share Posted March 31, 2007 That's appalling - I can't imagine how bad that is. I know what I'd be doing if I was her son though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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