Ridiculous rape laws...

[Twiglet]

I'm afraid this is a total non-story,the justice system operated exactly as it should have.

 

To find someone guilty there has to be proof beyond all reasonable doubt that the crime was committed, in this case that burden of proof simply doesn't exist. Having seen many rape cases I'm actually surprised this one got as far as court.

 

According the the story the girl was NOT necessarily asleep - it says she 'woke up to find him having sex with her'. The story states her memory is extremely patchy so it might just be that this is the point where her memory begins. If she can't remember what happened she cannot possibly remember if she consented. What about the guy? If he was equally drunk he may have misconstrued her drunken actions as advances. I'm not going to go into the rights and wrongs of what consititutes rape, as it's simple enough that there is no proof this guy actually raped her.

 

I'm not excusing rape in any way it's a heinous and unforgivable crime, but we have to work within the confines of the law. The nature of our justice system is that more guilty people are released than innocent people convicted, but we can't just go putting people in prison willy nilly without proof.

[Bago]

You're presuming that everyone who complains they have been raped has been but that is not the reality and crying rape for malicious, vindictive reasons is also a common crime so each case has to tried on the facts and nothing else.

You yourself also seems to be presuming that if a woman prosecute it is because of her crying wolf. If which case, if I was the woman and a victim, I will feel suicidal in seeing the lack of judgement from sensible people of the general public, and I would be in dispair too.

[Darbees]

You yourself also seems to be presuming that if a woman prosecute it is because of her crying wolf. If which case, if I was the woman and a victim, I will feel suicidal in seeing the lack of judgement from sensible people of the general public, and I would be in dispair too.

No, no, no. What I'm saying is that you can't presume anything until you've seen ALL the evidence and if there isn't sufficient to convict they have to acquit.

[liam1412]

Surely, you cannot just say that, those who feel ashamed of it won't ever bring the case forward and actually prosecute the guy.

 

Definately not saying that. You were saying why would someone put them selves through the shame and humiliation if it wasn't true. My point is that the humiliation only comes from actually being raped. Therefore a girl who is falsely accusing someone doesn't feel the shame you were talking about.

 

I didn't know how some females feel, but I recall reading from some of the charities website about feeling guilty, and becoming introverted from the experience.

 

This is exactly my point. In most cases a girl would theoretically happily bring the man to justice, while feeling no shame for what happened, until they have actually being raped. It is then that they become introverted, and filled with self blame and in some cases actually beleiving "Well I brought it on myself".

 

I also hope that you are not saying that those who DO bring cases forward are the ones that are doing it with malicious intent.

 

Again im not saying that at all. Without wanting to offend i think you may have misread the point of my post. Im not saying this to cause the usual SF slagging match (wich admittedly I have occasionally being involved in) but I was trying to argue (in a civilised manner of course) that the people who cry wolf are not putting them self through the shame is only caused by actually being raped. A non rape victim would not ever think they would be ashamed by being the victim of a rape. When a rape occurs however, the events jade you thoughts on the matter and wrongfully make you beleive that it is something to be ashamed of.

[Bago]

No one should - but as most people are aware we live in a far from perfect world so isn't a little bit of precautionary soberness a good move?

 

Are you implying that to the guy in question in this legal case?

[hazel]

I do not think anyone would go into reporting rape lightly so therefore I do not think many claims are false.

Not many cases are proven which must be a nightmare for the woman who has plucked up courage to go through with it.

I once was on a jury for a rape case 9 men 3 women and was amazed at the difference in interpretations of the same case and how much it said about mankind.

 

hazel

[mikey10]

i certainly wasn't suggesting that a woman's word is worth more in a rape case than a man's. given that the rates for successful convictions in rape cases have dropped over the last 30 years, i'd say exactly the opposite - the word of the accusing woman is worth less than that of the defending man, and becoming worth even less as the justice systems relies increasingly on evidence rather than heresay.

 

i'm very sorry that your nephew was falsly accused of rape, but that hardly means that a lot women who accuse a man of rape are doing so with nothing firmer than a nasty vendetta in mind. personally i imagine that most women who put themselves through the public shame of a rape trial, not to mention the well-documented mysogynism of the police, and the indignity of having their person intimately examined, are doing it because they have been raped. given how much coverage there has been in the press recently about how many women who go to the police alleging rape are 'encouraged' to drop their charges when they should have been pursued, i imagine the women who actually get to court are very much the tip of the iceberg, and not even all of them will get a conviction.

 

mikey10, i would ask you again to qualify your remark that there seems to be 'a lot of women falsly claiming rape because of some grudge'. unless you can support a comment like that, you should probably keep it to yourself; what you have said is belittling to women who have made rape allegations, which, as i have said, i suspect to be a very unpleasant experience for the woman to go through. just because your personal experience of rape has been taht of crying wolf, it doens't mean that most other cases are the same.

 

just read the papers, it happens, john leslie was ruined, and still is because of accusations that were never prooved, theres been instances of footballers quiet often in the press and other celebs. i differ from you because im not predudiced by the sex i am. basically people canot be locked up if there is no evidence.some women lie and predudice women who have been raped. this makes it more difficult to convict. what im trying to say is that women need to look at themselves (those who make false accusations) because they are doing women who are victims no favours. even if a woman has been raped the guilty party cannot be convicted if there is no evidence. its a basic priciple of british justice, which is flawed....

[evildrneil]

Are you implying that to the guy in question in this legal case?

 

It was a general comment that should apply to both parties in this case

[Roop]

The hideous fact of the matter is that in many circumstances rape takes place where there is no witnesses by someone the victim knew.

 

It makes it an intrinsically difficult crime to prosecute on the grounds that it is often the word of one against another unless there is physical evidence that it was forced on the victim (bruises etc.)

 

This sort of alleged "date" rape is difficult to prove. It is just his word against hers and the sad fact of the matter is that justice may not be served because of the lack of evidence.

 

But what is the alternative? Guilty until proven innocent- If an accusation is made then you have to prove that you had permission. It kind of takes the passion out of the moment when a bloke whips out a contract confirming you have given consent in flagrante delicto.

 

Unfortunatly the only thing a girl can do is her best not to get in to that situation because unfortunatly there are a lot of unpleasant people out there who dont worry about being prosecuted.

 

And for the men, there isnt really any excuse, if in any doubt ask.. if they dont answer yes then you dont have permission. If they do youll laugh about it in the morning and come across as a caring thoughtful bloke.

[Grahame]

You can always walk away.