goldenfleece Posted December 29, 2008 Share Posted December 29, 2008 It's not uncommon to see Pub Landlords doing their 'own doors' from time to time, without having an SIA badge. Thos occurs in areas where there are lots of community pubs and they cant afford normal door staff, or cant get any, for whatever reason. To settle an argument, what is the position re the law, because the law seems a bit vague about this. As a Pub Landlord, you have the right to refuse service, and the right to remove persons from the premises with reasonable force as necessary, protecting your customers, the security of the venue, and upholding the terms of the licensing Act, as every Landlord has a personal licence, plus may also be DPS too. Interpreting this, a Pub Landlord, carrying out the responsibilites of the licensing Act, can also decide who comes in and who does not, and man his own doors. I did the SIA course last year and am wondering if it was a waste of money, as so many Landlords just traditionally man their own doors, and chuck people out, which as Personal Licence Holders, and in control of the venue, they have the right to do so. I do not believe the law states that no Pub or Venue owner can not control entry without an SIA badge, but what is the general view about this? A Pub landlord is protecting his premises and his custom, and surely no law states he may not stand outside his own Pub and refuse entry as he deems fit. That is the traditional way.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
green Posted December 29, 2008 Share Posted December 29, 2008 It is a grey area within legislation, and i believe it is upto each individual council/police licensing dept as is what is their reading of it. To date, i have not heard or read anything to say that a landlord etc has being taken to review or court for not having an S.I.A badge and dealing with doorstaff duties within their venue. May i suggest that this is to remain as it would be immediately fought in court. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldenfleece Posted December 29, 2008 Share Posted December 29, 2008 It is a grey area within legislation, and i believe it is upto each individual council/police licensing dept as is what is their reading of it. To date, i have not heard or read anything to say that a landlord etc has being taken to review or court for not having an S.I.A badge and dealing with doorstaff duties within their venue. May i suggest that this is to remain as it would be immediately fought in court. I agree. Any Landlord has a duty under the Licensing Act to refuse to serve those who are drunk or intoxicated in any way, or who are in any way a compromise to the safety of customers. A Landlord may eject those he chooses who are drunk and disorderly or who compromise safety or security of customers/premises.....this means that in order to prevent problems inside the premises, any landlord may at his/her discretion refuse entry on their own doors to whoever they see as a threat to the conditions already described. Any Landlord who does not do this is not really enforcing the objectives of the Licensing Act and once certain rogue elements are actually inside the premises, it can be far more dfficult to get them out. A lot of community pubs on Xmas Eve, key dates of the year, etc, have Landlords manning the doors, and this has always been the case...... A registered Door Supervisor has no more powers legally than a Pub Landlord in fact if anything a Landlord has MORE power, as he is directly enforcing the licensing objectives on his/her premises........I have been asked this by other Landlords often, as I stated before, not all pubs can afford doorstaff. Plus a good Landlord knows the locals, and the troublemakers, and can act accordingly, whereas a doorman, unless he is a regular, will not know the 'community' and its 'characters'! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrooveArmada Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 Doorman have to put up with back chat most of the time and personally i feel it is acceptable for the doorman to behave in the way they did with yourself always two sides to a story Lesson to be learnt not to let your mouth run away with it self and expect nothing to happen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shane39 Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 I'd go along with that. Once got turned away for having a jumper on, even tho it was about -5. Plus i've seen them turn away a few people for having the wrong type of trainers on. A friend of mine was refused entry in a Sheff town pub because his boots were of a certain name,which the Doorman explained were the type worn by football hooligans. I asked the doorman,"if Stephen Hawkins arrived with the same boots on,would he be refused entry"?He replied "YES" A lot of the time if ya face don't fit,you aint going to get in. One this occasion the doormen were quite apologetic,and said it was management policy.But you can bet in the current credit crunch climate,that policy will be thrown out the window.They need our custom more than ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmatt Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 Door staff are nothing like they used to be, due to changes in the law and the way door staff are licenced. Years ago "Bouncers" may have got away with more than they do now. All people see when they are on a night out is " look at that doorman he has just punched that young lad for no reason", people dont see what goes off before. Alot of people had bad views of doormen. There are always bad eggs in every job but can you imagine a night out down town without doorstaff working anywhere, you would have something to moan about then. It would be mayhem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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