Is reasonable force reasonable?

[Cyclone]

Not really what the thread is about, but I don't think suggesting that stopping someone who's attacking you with a hammer is easy is going to help the topic.

[Grahame]

What I stated was fact. It is what I would do in a particular cirumstance and my reasoning for it. I don't know whether a court would agree that such actions are reasonable... frankly it wouldn't make a difference to me.

 

What I would do Zamo, is this. If someone was coming at me waving a hammer over his head, I would simply take hold of his wrist with both hands, then I would turn my back on him and make sure his arm was on my shoulder. Then I would simply crouch down holding his wrist as low as possible. He only has one way to go, that is straight over my shoulder and flat on his back with all he wind knocked out of him.

 

All I have done is to hold his hand and bend down, you can't do much less than that.

 

 

[Crayfish]

would reasonable force from a well advertised martial art specialist be different to that from a joe bloggs.

 

being that "you" know how to defend yourself expertly, you know how to disarm and injure expertly, and are trained in the art of self defence.

so if a youth - who you calculated you could disarm with your skill threatened you and you pre empted his attack, would that not be unreasonable if not unnecessary force.

as you are the expert ,and the attack would be unfairly weighted in your favour.

 

it could be viewed that way from a jury standpoint - you've almost "taken a gun to a knife fight".

 

You have a point. I think that if the encounter involved someone versed in martial arts, they'd be expected to have more control over the situation and more knowledge about what reasonable force involves.

[Crayfish]

What I would do Zamo, is this. If someone was coming at me waving a hammer over his head, I would simply take hold of his wrist with both hands, then I would turn my back on him and make sure his arm was on my shoulder. Then I would simply crouch down holding his wrist as low as possible. He only has one way to go, that is straight over my shoulder and flat on his back with all he wind knocked out of him.

 

 

 

Very judo. Don't try it. Run!

 

Won't go into the technicalities but a lot could go wrong with that and I wouldn't be so confident. Myself, I'd run

[Zamo]

What I would do Zamo, is this. If someone was coming at me waving a hammer over his head, I would simply take hold of his wrist with both hands, then I would turn my back on him and make sure his arm was on my shoulder. Then I would simply crouch down holding his wrist as low as possible. He only has one way to go, that is straight over my shoulder and flat on his back with all he wind knocked out of him.

 

All I have done is to hold his hand and bend down, you can't do much less than that.

 

 

 

I think you've been watching too much James Bond!

[Grahame]

Very judo. Don't try it. Run!

 

Won't go into the technicalities but a lot could go wrong with that and I wouldn't be so confident. Myself, I'd run

 

That is what people say and I have run a few marathons.

[Cyclone]

would reasonable force from a well advertised martial art specialist be different to that from a joe bloggs.

 

being that "you" know how to defend yourself expertly, you know how to disarm and injure expertly, and are trained in the art of self defence.

so if a youth - who you calculated you could disarm with your skill threatened you and you pre empted his attack, would that not be unreasonable if not unnecessary force.

as you are the expert ,and the attack would be unfairly weighted in your favour.

 

it could be viewed that way from a jury standpoint - you've almost "taken a gun to a knife fight".

 

The idea that anyone who trains once a week suddenly becomes an 'expert' is a mistake.

As is the fact that having some training means that you are invincible.

 

At best it gives you an edge. But it doesn't make you a superman or a fighting machine, if you start trying to calculate what to do, and trying to minimise the force used you'd be better off having no training at all.

The point of the training is that you use it to full effect and you have a better chance of not being beaten up or killed, not that you can hold back and still avoid those things.

[Cyclone]

What I would do Zamo, is this. If someone was coming at me waving a hammer over his head, I would simply take hold of his wrist with both hands, then I would turn my back on him and make sure his arm was on my shoulder. Then I would simply crouch down holding his wrist as low as possible. He only has one way to go, that is straight over my shoulder and flat on his back with all he wind knocked out of him.

 

All I have done is to hold his hand and bend down, you can't do much less than that.

 

 

 

And we would all post nice things in the thread saying "Grahame is sadly no longer with us after being bludgeoned to death by someone with a hammer".

 

Running is a good plan, so long as you aren't at home (ie unable to run) and you think you're faster than him (and you don't have anyone slow with you who you like).

[Grahame]

And we would all post nice things in the thread saying "Grahame is sadly no longer with us after being bludgeoned to death by someone with a hammer".

 

Running is a good plan, so long as you aren't at home (ie unable to run) and you think you're faster than him (and you don't have anyone slow with you who you like).

 

Yeah problems, it is difficult as you say, anyway as long as you say nice things I shan't mind.

[Cyclone]

It would be petty to be nasty after you'd been killed trying to do some sort of armlock/throw on a hammer wielding attacker. So at least if I couldn't say anything nice, i'd say nothing.