But is it art?

[downandout]

I don't like HeadingNorth's test. Tracey Emin's "My Bed" was art and was rubbish at the same time. If you put her mess in a pile of other mess, it would be hard to know which was which. Context and intent is the key.

 

And seconded that too.

[Phanerothyme]

Many renaissance painters would get students to do all the tedious bits, have them practice painting clouds etc, whilst they would swan in at some later stage to do all the important stuff like faces, hands, cloth etc.

 

I just think there's art that people like, and art that people don't like. Art that people don't like is often classified as not art by the people that don't like it.

 

Art is also in the mind of the beholder. If in your frame of reference it is not art, then it is not art. But your frame of reference is completely unique to you and you cannot say with any certainty that the thing is not art to anyone else.

 

The art market is of course something quite different to art.

[Chris_Sleeps]

When I was younger I hated pretentious art, but after a lot of thought I really enjoy it now. I enjoy the fact that it winds people up aswell.

 

If all that human beings ever found interesting was pretty pictures then it would be dull. I like music to be uncomfortable and hard sometimes (Wagner, Sonic Youth) and I don't want all the books I read to be about happy lives. I want ugly sometimes, and I want pointless sometimes. Banality is the only thing that is truly worthless.

[Jessica23]

One of my favourite well known pieces is "The Scream". Name one of yours? (out of interest?)

 

Oooh, good question.

 

Of things I've actually seen, there was a small Rodin (title escapes me) which was awful and compelling and Picasso's variations on Le Dejeuner sur l'herbe exhibited with the Manet version which I LOVED.

[Jessica23]

Thoughts on title seconded. Brilliant. And just a bit relevant to the discussion...

 

Well, quite.

[llamatron]

I don't like HeadingNorth's test. Tracey Emin's "My Bed" was art and was rubbish at the same time. If you put her mess in a pile of other mess, it would be hard to know which was which. Context and intent is the key.

 

That was headingnorths point and I completely agree with him. It is subjective but that test works well for me!

[llamatron]

Oooh, good question.

 

Of things I've actually seen, there was a small Rodin (title escapes me) which was awful and compelling and Picasso's variations on Le Dejeuner sur l'herbe exhibited with the Manet version which I LOVED.

 

different taste in art confirmed:gag:

 

I don't like abstract art much although there are exceptions, I tend not to even look at rennaisance paitnings and portraits because they bore me. I do like landscapes and paintings of ships in storms-I am obsessed with clouds! I like photography as well.

 

I also like ye olde porn ...well some tasteful ye olde porn (the 70s was a good decade for that although the 80s was abyssmal!!!)

[Jessica23]

different taste in art confirmed:gag:

 

It won't have come as a shock

[Phanerothyme]

One of my favourite well known pieces is "The Scream". Name one of yours? (out of interest?)

 

favourites I've seen (I'd love to see some Munch)

 

Empor, by Kandinsky. At the Guggenheim in Venice.

 

Clothing of the Bride, by Ernst. At the same.

 

A Game of Patience, by Frampton, at the Ferens, Hull.

 

Field for the British Isles, by Gormley, at several locations.

[Chris_Sleeps]

That was headingnorths point and I completely agree with him.

HeadingNorth's point was that if art cannot be distinguished from rubbish, then it is not art. If the art is literally rubbish then it is impossible for that to pass his test.

 

Yet art can be made out of literal rubbish, if there is an intent and a context to it. It could be a point about consumerism, or the environment, but you strip it of all artistic merit because of the methods used and not the message sent. It's not a fair test at all.